Tuesday, 29 June 2010

Windows CE Live Chat Transcript June 2010

Hello guys,

Just in case you missed the MS Live chat today, the transcript of the chat is available here.

GLanger[MS] (Expert)[2010-6-29 18:6]: Hi, I'm Glen Langer, PM on the Core Team for Windows Embedded Compact

rajran[MS] (Expert)[2010-6-29 18:8]: Hi, I'm Rajeev Rangappa. PM on the Core team for Windows Embedded Compact

davbo-MSFT (Moderator)[2010-6-29 18:12]:

Q: Hi!. Does exist too many differences in DirectShow between CE 4.2 and 5 or 6? Because I have been trying to play mpeg1 video with WMP (CE 6.0 R3 and CE 5.0) in an ARM platform and in a X86 platform, but it plays very slow (~5 fps). But when I tried with my x86 platform with wince 4.2, it plays fine! Also, with alternative software (TCPMP) I can play fine too (in 5.0 and 6.0), but i need to do it with WMP. Thank you!

A: Hello Leonardo, Windows Embedded Compact 7 is available as a Public CTP (Community Tech Preview) which includes optimizations for MPEG-1 streaming. If there is a BSP available for your platform please try the Public CTP. Windows Embedded Compact 7 Public CTP

davbo-MSFT (Moderator)[2010-6-29 18:12]:

A: http://www.microsoft.com/windowsembedded/en-us/products/windowsce/compact7.mspx

Travis Hobrla [MS] (Expert)[2010-6-29 18:14]:

Q: Hi, we are trying to build, on Windows CE 6.0 (R2, last tests with R3), a DPWS device acting also as a host. We are trying to use WSDAPI.

Here the 2 problems we are facing:

1. Registering multiple service instances (at the moment not supported in the Windows CE WSDAPI stack, we have been said). A possible workaround is to host each of the service instances on multiple device hosts, but there is a limitation of 5 device hosts, indicated in Windows CE 6.0 R2 release notes (it does not seem to be improved in R3).

We don't know if the feature is supported (or the workaround improved) in Windows CE 7 (Public CTP), can you help us?

2. We have a problem in receiving UDP multicast on ARMv4i board. WSDAPI-based communication fails as multicast requests (Resolve/probe messages) are sent but not received on the board (verified with Netmon and netlogctl), even if we avoid using activeSynch. Besides the emulator limitation, are there Windows Ce issues concerning multicast with real HW?

A: For #2, I don't believe there are limitations. Are the multicasts failing to trigger the ethernet driver's receive function?

kurtken_msft (Expert)[2010-6-29 18:15]:

Q: What is the tool chain for developing for Windows Embedded Commpact 7? (ie. what versions of visual studio and such)

A: Windows Embedded Compact 7 installs as a plug-in to Visual Studio 2008.

Travis Hobrla [MS] (Expert)[2010-6-29 18:19]:

Q: In response to Travis Hobrla, yes, it seems so. So it could be a driver problem, you suggest?

A: Yes, if you're not picking up multicast at the driver level then you need to debug why that is the case. Perhaps you have configured the driver to execute a hardware filter that rejects multicasts?

davbo-MSFT (Moderator)[2010-6-29 18:25]:

Q: @davbo-MSFT: I'll try, but this application is for a released product, we can't update O.S.. So, I would like to modify "something" in order to improve fps. I thought that my board (Mini2440, ARM) was not so powerful to play videos, but other software can do it (TCPMP), but it may not use DShow, just DDraw (i'm not 100% sure about it). But in older boards with CE 4.2 it works well! I tried editing CEPlayIt example, but nothing... any other idea?? Thank you!

A: Can you provide details about the video file? What is the size, audio format, video format, resolution, etc..? Are you playing locally? If so using SATA, USB, SD, Flash, etc... or are you playing over HTTP?

davbo-MSFT (Moderator)[2010-6-29 18:25]:

Q: Hi!. Does exist too many differences in DirectShow between CE 4.2 and 5 or 6? Because I have been trying to play mpeg1 video with WMP (CE 6.0 R3 and CE 5.0) in an ARM platform and in a X86 platform, but it plays very slow (~5 fps). But when I tried with my x86 platform with wince 4.2, it plays fine! Also, with alternative software (TCPMP) I can play fine too (in 5.0 and 6.0), but i need to do it with WMP. Thank you!

A: Answered and following up for more details

davbo-MSFT (Moderator)[2010-6-29 18:29]:

Q: What is the tool chain for developing for Windows Embedded Commpact 7? (ie. what versions of visual studio and such)

A: Visual Studio 2008 SP1 then Platform Builder w/ Windows Embedded Compact 7 Installation. Windows Embedded Compact 7 Public CTP now available:

<http://www.microsoft.com/windowsembedded/en-us/products/windowsce/compact7.mspx>>

Travis Hobrla [MS] (Expert)[2010-6-29 18:30]:

Q: [to Travis] No, we haven't. But we know that there is a problem also in the board (BSP Evaluation Kit for AT91SAM9263E, "Multicast not implemented" in the technical design document). We just wanted to know if Windows CE had some limitations on its own on the hw side, and you said that it hasn't. About the Device Emulator, do you know if R3 or Windows Embedded Compact 7 solve the issue of not receiving multicast messages?

A: CE doesn't have limitations on the HW side, the BSP (not the OS) is firmly in control of what happens at the HW level for ethernet controllers. I don't believe there have been any substantial updates to the Device Emulator in R3, sorry. I assume the multicast limitation has to do with the way the NIC is emulated / connected to the desktop NIC.

Sing Wee [MS] (Expert)[2010-6-29 18:31]:

Q: Hi, I'm having some trouble with the CETK Storage Device Block Driver Read/Write test #2003. It is failing for my FMD since I upgraded CE6 from R2 to R3 and applied the latest QFEs. I noticed the test has changed from using four 1KB buffers to some larger buffer sizes. Is this test incompatible with the FMD interface now?

A: Gary, would you mind sharing the error messages that are returned? (Snippet from test log will be fine). I'm trying to find someone who might have the answer to your question.

Sing Wee [MS] (Expert)[2010-6-29 18:32]:

Q: So no one has ideas on my XAML Silverlight problems?

A: I've sent off an email to some folks who might have some insight. Could you please private message me your email address in case they've got some answers for you?

davbo-MSFT (Moderator)[2010-6-29 18:33]:

Q: So no one has ideas on my XAML Silverlight problems?

A: We are talking with engineers in the background to help answer your question. Please stay tuned and if we can't address today will work to get a response and post in the transcript.

kurtken_msft (Expert)[2010-6-29 18:37]:

Q: Will you please briefly discuss the sound support options for windows CE? We would like to play various types of sound files from our C# applications.

A: Hi Ben. Besides normal uncompressed PCM files, if you are playing without using DirectShow you can use any codec that can plug into the Audio Compression Manager (ACM). There are simple codecs available on the internet and you can build your own if you like. If you want more advanced media rendering capability I suggest you look at the DirectShow APIs.

Travis Hobrla [MS] (Expert)[2010-6-29 18:38]:

Q: Hi, we are trying to build, on Windows CE 6.0 (R2, last tests with R3), a DPWS device acting also as a host. We are trying to use WSDAPI.

Here the 2 problems we are facing:

1. Registering multiple service instances (at the moment not supported in the Windows CE WSDAPI stack, we have been said). A possible workaround is to host each of the service instances on multiple device hosts, but there is a limitation of 5 device hosts, indicated in Windows CE 6.0 R2 release notes (it does not seem to be improved in R3).

We don't know if the feature is supported (or the workaround improved) in Windows CE 7 (Public CTP), can you help us?

2. We have a problem in receiving UDP multicast on ARMv4i board. WSDAPI-based communication fails as multicast requests (Resolve/probe messages) are sent but not received on the board (verified with Netmon and netlogctl), even if we avoid using activeSynch. Besides the emulator limitation, are there Windows Ce issues concerning multicast with real HW?

A: Just got information on #1: we haven't changed anything for this in the CE7 PCTP - so you are still limited to 5 hosts/clients in WSDAPI.

kurtken_msft (Expert)[2010-6-29 18:39]:

Q: ...Scatter/Gather Buffer[2]..........(0x00044FA0) ...Scatter/Gather Buffer[2] Length...(4096) ...Scatter/Gather Buffer[3]..........(0x00045FA0) ...Scatter/Gather Buffer[3] Length...(8192) Submitting read request.

Verifying...

Incorrect data at 0x000447A0. Expected: 0x00000200, Received: 0x00000100. Incorrect data at 0x000447A4. Expected: 0x000001FF, Received: 0x000000FF. Incorrect data at 0x000447A8. Expected: 0x000001FE, Received: 0x000000FE.

A: cool!

Sing Wee [MS] (Expert)[2010-6-29 18:42]:

Q: ...Scatter/Gather Buffer[2]..........(0x00044FA0) ...Scatter/Gather Buffer[2] Length...(4096) ...Scatter/Gather Buffer[3]..........(0x00045FA0) ...Scatter/Gather Buffer[3] Length...(8192) Submitting read request.

Verifying...

Incorrect data at 0x000447A0. Expected: 0x00000200, Received: 0x00000100. Incorrect data at 0x000447A4. Expected: 0x000001FF, Received: 0x000000FF. Incorrect data at 0x000447A8. Expected: 0x000001FE, Received: 0x000000FE.

A: Hey Gary, this appears to be very similar to an issue we've seen in CE6 as well, related to the FAL in CE6 that has been addressed in CE7. Is there any reason you won't be able to try out CE7? http://www.microsoft.com/windowsembedded/en-us/products/windowsce/compact7.mspx

davbo-MSFT (Moderator)[2010-6-29 18:42]:

Q: @BarnettD: Ok I will look into those links thanks. @davbo-MSFT (Moderator) I am new to these chats, where do I get a copy of the transcript later on, and thanks ?

A: Previous Transcripts: <http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/chats/bb250671.aspx>;. This transcript will be posted a couple of days after the chat.

kurtken_msft (Expert)[2010-6-29 18:42]:

Q: With the latest BSP for our platform the touch screen driver does not load unless Explorer is used as the shell (normally our application serves as the shell); any Ideas on what I should look at to trouble shoot this issue?

A: hi Ben. You may have to run the touch calibration in order to get the touch driver to work. Also, is there an error message when the touch driver does not load? do you see it try to load?

davbo-MSFT (Moderator)[2010-6-29 18:43]:

Q: @davbo-MSFT: I forget audio!: I tried without audio, but it's the same. Original file has MPEG1 Layer 2 Audio Codec, with 192 kb/s

A: Thanks for the additional info and we'll look into performance. If you can provide the media file that would help speed up the investigation. alias: davbo domain: microsoft.com

davbo-MSFT (Moderator)[2010-6-29 18:44]:

Q: @davbo-MSFT: it is an MPEG-1 Video, 320x240, Bitrate: 993 kb/s, Size: 2 Mb, I have tried with file in a lot of locations: SD, USB flash drive, even into NK.bin. Board i'm using has as storage unit a NAND Flash memory

A: Thanks for the additional info and we'll look into performance. If you can provide the media file that would help speed up the investigation. alias: davbo domain: microsoft.com

Travis Hobrla [MS] (Expert)[2010-6-29 18:45]:

Q: [to Travis] Ohh, ok, thank you. I suppose I can't ask you if there is a plan for future releases to enhance the limitation or support multiple service instances registration ...

A: We don't have plans to fix this that I know of, but I will see if I can make this happen. Can you give me some ammunition (i.e. why is this necessary for your product to succeed) that I can use to make a case for this?

Sing Wee [MS] (Expert)[2010-6-29 18:50]:

Q: I am currently developing a set of drivers on WINCE 6.0. I have R3 and all the montlhy updates up until February 2010. I am trying to add support for silver light and XAML. ( I am new to this). I have followed the msdn example on how to create the bubbles.xaml, bounce.xaml, and carousel.xaml demos. I have create the xamlperf.exe app and i can see the demos on the deskptop when the wince device boots up. BUt when I try to run the demos I can see a window that tries to open and then the window creation seems to stop (the window doesn't show up). In the debugger I can see the "performance info" that it outputs but I also get an "ALCHEMY error"

Any ideas what I am missing. All of my demos seem to get built but when I run them I don't see any output on the screen and on the debugger window i see "[ALCHEMY] Failed to Draw the element tree in HWND 0x70026530. Error code 0x8000ffff . ANy ideas what may be wrong?

A: KibKid, what type of drivers are you developing? Display drivers? Also, which SYSGENs are set in your build environment? (If you open a build window, just do a "set SYS".

Sing Wee [MS] (Expert)[2010-6-29 18:51]:

Q: Well, I need to download and test with CE7 also, but I'm providing FMD and PDD for Spansion flash products to customers using various versions of CE. If there is a problem with FAL in CE6, then I would like to understand how to point my customers to the fix and if I should tell them to just avoid CE6 FAL and use a different version of CE...

A: Gary, can you please send me your private email address? I'm trying to get you answers.

davbo-MSFT (Moderator)[2010-6-29 18:52]:

Q: [to Travis] Ok, thanks. Same for Windows Embedded Compact 7, I suppose. I don't know if you could you also help me with my question 1 about WSDAPI (registering multiple service instances not supported).

A: Good link on WSDAPI if you haven't seen it yet. http://blogs.msdn.com/b/dandris/archive/2007/11/09/wsdapi-101-part-1-web-services-from-10-000-feet.aspx. I got some answers from the team managing the Windows CE side WSDAPI (which is different from the one on a Windows PC). Windows CE WSDAPI stack does not allow registering multiple services with the same name. Doing so will result in the error (CWSDSession:ispatcherIsUnique).

I can offer you two workarounds here.

1. Host each of the service instances on multiple device hosts, and have the clients contact different instances of the service by means of the device host’s address.

2. Duplicate the same service and give those duplicated services different names so that you can host them on the same device host, and have the client contact those different services instead. You have to do

davbo-MSFT (Moderator)[2010-6-29 18:53]:

Q: @davbo-MSFT: of course!... I'll send you my file by email just now, thank you!

A: thanks

Sing Wee [MS] (Expert)[2010-6-29 18:54]:

Q: I've already installed QFEs up through May 31st 2010. Will you release a FAL fix as QFE for CE6? I assume many of my customers would rather not move to a new version of CE. Probably a fix to the FAL would be a preferred solution.

A: Yes, I understand the concern.

Chien-her[MS] (Expert)[2010-6-29 18:54]:

Q: Any ideas what I am missing. All of my demos seem to get built but when I run them I don't see any output on the screen and on the debugger window i see "[ALCHEMY] Failed to Draw the element tree in HWND 0x70026530. Error code 0x8000ffff . ANy ideas what may be wrong?

A: 0x8000ffff is E_UNEXPECTED

Travis Hobrla [MS] (Expert)[2010-6-29 18:57]:

Q: [to Travis] Yes, I am working on a M2M platform. At the web service level, we are treating all the services exposed by sensors/devices in the same logical way, and we can in this way deal with a number of services that can change dynamically in the network. By the way, my company in Italy has signed a “Non Disclosure Agreement” with Microsoft (in case this is needed, I can provide details about it).

A: Thanks Cris. I will promote this and see if we can make a fix (no guarantees, of course).

davbo-MSFT (Moderator)[2010-6-29 18:57]:

Q: @davbo-MSFT: ok, mail sent with attached file, please remove me from your spam folder (if i'm in it )

A: got the email - thanks

Chien-her[MS] (Expert)[2010-6-29 18:57]:

A: You will need to check out your display driver and ddraw. In R3, Alchemy graphic simulation could be done by GDI or DDraw. So you will need to check out the display diver support 2D acceleration or not and DDraw is in image or not. Any way as Sing mentioned the image configuration, SYSGEN_*, BSP_*, and IMG* flags.

davbo-MSFT (Moderator)[2010-6-29 18:57]:

Q: [to davbo] Thanks for the link and the info, we already know them but I appreciate your help

A: np

davbo-MSFT (Moderator)[2010-6-29 19:0]: Hello everyone, we are just about out of time.

Thank you for joining us for our Windows Embedded CE 6.0 chat today!

<http://www.Microsoft.com/Embedded>;

A special thank you to the product group members for coming out.

The transcript of today’s chat will be posted online as soon as possible, to <http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/chats>;. We’ll see you again for another chat next month. Please check <http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/chats>; for the list of upcoming chats.

Have fun!

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